bi level is for posers!

Mr. F · Ollie Joined: 26 Jul 2004 Posts: 52

Right On Tribal! Very Happy

BillyOLDS · Posted: Sep 16, 2004 10:26 am Post subject:

i can ollie and keep the board with me on a concave and slide my foot and all just like sk8ing. but i stiill want to try the bi lev is about and what not.

electricsnow · cassette Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 10755 City: Jefferton

This is actually a really childish thread...like something I'd expect from 13 year old. It seems like when you call someone a poser, it's like you're trying to make yourself feel bigger. But, there are some points I disagree with, so here I am.

Firstly, the idea that this wakeskate deems one a poser is BS. How many beginners are really going to spend close to 300.00 on a brand new wakeskate, when one dude had a difficult time selling his integrity for 200.00 (and people raved about that thing)? It's baloney, wakeskating isn't really at that stage yet. I got some crooked looks when I said I spent 275.00 on my wakeskate, from a bunch of wakeboarders that had 600.00-800.00 set-ups. As someone else said, a higher end deck like this is for the serious rider that wants a high performance board (much like the integrity--sorry, but they're a good example).

Secondly, I also think it's ridiculous to say that a bi-level takes the simplicity out of wakeskating. Everyone has different riding styles, everyone has different goals for their riding, and everyone has different needs and wants in a wakeskate. And what's considered simple in a wakeskate? The fact that it's just a 9-ply flat? Or is it simple becuase it's 17-plys and milled? A 35.00 compression molded deck? There is one other deck out there that is (in my mind) just as technical as the bi-level (or maybe more so) but in a different way. If guys like thomas and erich don't explore other creative avenues in wakeskating, the design will become stagnant, and so will the art.

EDIT: and really, how much farther can one push a wooden concave design? Maybe I'm being shortsighted on this one, so I'm not seeing much else coming from them. And seriously, if cassette stayed with this same line and didn't do much else to improve the designs, people would be bitching, because that's what they did last year when they thought that cassette didn't do anything new with their decks.

And if you really think it takes the simplicity out of wakeskating, just don't buy it. I love the fact that you really CAN ride a flat deck and still kill it. But others prefer the control a concave provides--you can't knock them for that. Everyone has different wants and needs. And I've never heard anyone say "buy a concave because that's what thomas rides."

It's actually freaking funny to me that people are trying to come up with a definiton of what wakeskating really is...SCREW PROGRESSION!!! Twin tips, highbacks, and honeycombs--OH MY!

Johnny utah, I agree with you. It's weird, I actually have a hard time taking snowskating seriously. It's interesting that wakeskating didn't end up the same way...maybe because there were interested people right from the start that wanted to make it a legitimate thing. who knows...

Mr. F · Ollie Joined: 26 Jul 2004 Posts: 52

Electric snow I always admired your posts and agreed with most of them.

You should try out snowskating this winter (I mean going down a blue diamond with it) and really ride it,

down hill,

shuvit,

heelflip, and all ...and I will try a bi.level and then we can continue this shred both knowing what we are talking about. deal? Question

PIRATE · Guest

chickity china the chinese chicken YEAH MR F. IM SO SICK OF ALL THIS KING OF COOL bulljive, EVERY ONE HAS GOT A NEW DESIGN WITH SPACE AGE TECHNOLOGY ANY ONE EVER RIDDEN A GATE I HAVE ONE AND LET ME TELL YOU IF I WASNT SO POOR ID TRAYED THAT fizzle IN FOR A MC DONALDS LUNCH TRAY, THANKS FOR BEING YOU MR F. NOW IM GOING BACK TO WORK XOXO PiRaTe AARRGGHHHHHHH.......DOWN WITH THE BI LEVEL, AND LETS MAKE THOMAS WALK THE PLANK....

electricsnow · cassette Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 10755 City: Jefferton

Actually, I do have a snowskate, albeit one of the early premieres ( the nico droz board). And quite frankly, the discussion you brought up took a completely different turn. So a bi-level on the water makes one a poser, but a bi-deck on the hill is dope? Ok...so am I a poser for having a plastic premier? PLease! I need to know the rules of legitimacy! ANd please tell me what clothes are cool too...

Sorry, I'm just not that into snowskating. I'll goof around, but I'd rather snowboard or skateboard.

And I never said you HAD to ride a bi-level, but it's ridiculous to call people a poser because they want an advanced deck, or that it will somehow ruin wakeskating (you know, because it's more complex and "it's not wakeskating"). I can't believe consistency is a bad thing, because one thing people beach about when it comes to wakeskating and contests is that the riders aren't consistent.

Mr. F · Ollie Joined: 26 Jul 2004 Posts: 52

Bi level in a Snowskate is necessary (ever try to go down hill with a premiere)
Bi Level in Wakeskating is yet to be defined! But if you wanna think that you 'll ride better and finaly land "real"ollie because you got a bi-level ...well it does sound poser to me (bi level should not be a short cut to flat decks)

Mr. F · Ollie Joined: 26 Jul 2004 Posts: 52

Electricsnow "I can't believe consistency is a bad thing, because one thing people beach about when it comes to wakeskating and contests is that the riders aren't consistent."

consitency will only come to you with practice grasshoper.....not with a new toy Shocked

freerider4 · Backside 180 Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 2462

so tribal, Mr. F are you saying that the skate decks we use today suck because they help us ollie higher than the ones people used back in the 70's and 80's.

electricsnow · cassette Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 10755 City: Jefferton

If you want to ollie, you'll have to know the basics, regardless of the deck you're on. All people have said, thus far, is that it improved their ollies by 25-50%, and that it seems to make their tricks more consistent. And if it's yet to be defined, how can you jump all over it right away and say it's for posers?

And quite frankly, I'm sure people have thought that jumping to a concave would improve their riding more than a flat deck would. I don't doubt that there are people that bought a certain board (not just one board, I'm talking about any higher level board) thinking that it would elevate their skills in some mystical manner. So it's unfair to blame it all on the bi-level.

And If we're going to discuss what's *really* necessary, then one could say that concaves are for posers, because all of the tricks that have been done on a concave have been done on a wooden flat. The difference is that for some people, they like the control of a concave, and it has helped the progression of wakeskating. And you know, I'm sure that's what the bi-level is there for, but some won't even let it get its foot in the door. (metaphorically, of course. I don't think there's a bi-level with a foot yet. But we're all waiting, I'm sure!!)

As for the bi-level snowskate, it's all about the terrain you're on. I've never tried going down a hill because I snowboard. and originally, they weren't even going down hill, and I don't really see anyone doing that (least of all, doing heelflips while doing so). And you know, joni malmi was kickflipping those old yellow flats in "technical difficulties." However you want to defend and legitimize it is fine with me, because I don't have any beef with either type of snowskate. Your concerns over the bi-level are issues that have probably been around since the first concave, if not earlier. So you know...whatever. later

EDIT: Well MR.F, you haven't ridden the deck, so you don't know how it will affect your riding. I totally agree that hard work is necessary, but good equipment isn't such a bad thing either. For instance, would a slob front to fakie be easier and performed more consistently on a twin tip or a directional, surf style board?

EDIT II: Yeah, I'm back. What's more baffling to me is what's considered a cheat and what isn't. What do you think a centerweighted wakeskate core is all about? It's supposed to give your board an axis to spin around to help out with kickflips. Quite frankly, I think people need to chill with the cheating claims and open their mind. Progressive equipment isn't such a bad thing (provided it isn't misrepresented). And as I said before, if you don't like the high end boards, DON"T BUY THEM! But again, I think it's rad that there are free-thinkers like schmaltz and thomas that can be creative and actually have an outlet to make their ideas become a reality and make them work.

Alright, I'm done. Mr.F, I do have to say that it was fun debating with you. It was nice to have a civil discussion on here, so thanks for that (seriously).

libertytatz · Ollie Joined: 15 Sep 2004 Posts: 77 City: Atlanta

The bi-level isn't there yet.maybe on the right track ,butt with the way it looks in those pics it is pretty gay.People do amazing tricks on style of boards that are out now,some innovations are good concave,no more wood,stuff like that.
Any body who has seen 20years of skateboarding trends knows that not every new idea is better,there has been some waky stuff that made it to the shelfs,that were hot for a second and then laughed at the next year.

Vance Collins · Guest

freerider4 · Backside 180 Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 2462

vance damn right they are sweet they ride quite sweetly to.

tribal · Posted: Sep 16, 2004 11:57 am Post subject:

Just to chime in.I think it's great that Erich,Thomas,etc are working on new things and ideas.It's all about progression.I just hate the hype and huge following these things have when next to no one has actually ridden these boards.We will just have to wait and see and by that I mean a couple years down the rode not tomorrow.
And as far as the bi-level goes I don't think it suits my personal taste,but that's just me.

Morphine · Backside 180 Joined: 03 Jun 2004 Posts: 1207 City: 706omg

*sigh* Tribal, I think I can trust Thomas when he says "The ride is fiznackling sweet"

Everyone's like "Oh let's do progression, OMG" and Cassette does something like this and all of the sudden progression is gay and not traditional enough.

Grouch · Kickflip Joined: 16 Feb 2004 Posts: 3146 City: The OC

Morphine,

Progression is not GAY...Mr. F is!!!

satori* · Posted: Sep 16, 2004 1:34 pm Post subject:

hahahahahahahaha. all one can do it laugh. all this deliberation is so pitiful.

let it go kids, let it go.

el · Backside 180 Joined: 07 Oct 2003 Posts: 1739 City: The Sea

I hate everything!!!

gregg · Backside 180 Joined: 08 Nov 2003 Posts: 681 City: Killen

well, a skateboard with two kicktail is an invention for skatboarding that helped people ride better and do new tricks more easily, so Mr. F i guess if you ride you are a pser, just like someone riding the bi-level.....right?! Crazy Eyes

vangimple · Posted: Sep 16, 2004 2:38 pm Post subject:

concaves are gay too. brian grubb is super-gay. and wakeskating IS for posers only. that's what all about - isn't it?

there is one difference between erich and thomas:

integrity skates look absolutely cool - best posing skate ever Wink

no matter how the bi-level rides - most of us just don't know - they just look xxl-gay.

and isn't wakeskating about looking good Question