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The Supreme Court's Guide to Wakeskate Media
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tad
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PostPosted: Oct 07, 2012 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scott a, agreed. I love my pelican. It's clutch at winch spots if you need to cross a river or any deep water, just float her across.
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scott a
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PostPosted: Oct 08, 2012 12:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tad wrote:
It's clutch at winch spots if you need to cross a river or any deep water, just float her across.
Water is a huuuge reason why I've been switching my gear over to a Pelican when I go houseboating or camping. It's so nice not having to worry about my gear getting wet.
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PostPosted: Oct 16, 2012 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

scott a wrote:
bmr712 wrote:
the body moves at 1/30th of a second and it is impossible to hand hold
I've never heard this theory/idea before. Can you elaborate a bit?


My professor said that basically your entire body moves at that speed. your eye, hands, reaction etc. It can be done to hand hold a picture slower then that but it is rare.

also i agree with the pelican case! if your going to invest in a camera invest in protecting it!
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PostPosted: Oct 16, 2012 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But...why? Did he offer any further explanation? Googling this turns up nothing.
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PostPosted: Oct 22, 2012 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bmr712, I know you know this, but for those using this thread as a guide: shooting wakeskating at anything below 1/250 will result in a blurry rider. I try and stick to at least 1/500.

But anyway, this thread is weird to me. There are some good tips, but it sort of suggests that there's a formula for how wakeskating should be documented. Want a good shot? Break rules, including your own. Still feel like your shots don't measure up? Shoot more. Leave your comfort zone. Take risks. Maybe your shot doesn't have to follow the rule of thirds; or maybe for this shot, the rider's whole body doesn't have to be in the frame. Maybe do shoot at f/1.8 and risk being slightly out of focus. Maybe in this shot, you could pull off a zoom. My point is: don't shoot blindly even if you're following some sort of guideline. Interpret, adapt, and make unique shít.

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PostPosted: Oct 22, 2012 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scott a, I love my Dakine bag. I don't think they sell my model anymore but it has so much storage along with water-proof pockets, tri-pod straps, and a built-in poncho.
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tad
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PostPosted: Oct 22, 2012 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slapdown wrote:
bmr712, I know you know this, but for those using this thread as a guide: shooting wakeskating at anything below 1/250 will result in a blurry rider. I try and stick to at least 1/500.

But anyway, this thread is weird to me. There are some good tips, but it sort of suggests that there's a formula for how wakeskating should be documented. Want a good shot? Break rules, including your own. Still feel like your shots don't measure up? Shoot more. Leave your comfort zone. Take risks. Maybe your shot doesn't have to follow the rule of thirds; or maybe for this shot, the rider's whole body doesn't have to be in the frame. Maybe do shoot at f/1.8 and risk being slightly out of focus. Maybe in this shot, you could pull off a zoom. My point is: don't shoot blindly even if you're following some sort of guideline. Interpret, adapt, and make unique shít.


Looks like someone skipped the opening paragraph.

Laughing

This whole thread was a half-sarcastic response to a comment in another thread and isn't meant to be taken whole-heartedly. (I thought the sarcasm was heavily-hinted, haha)

But anyways, no where did I suggest how to compose your shots or what f stop to shoot at. I interpreted years of experience, adapted it to my own vision and like to think I've created a number of unique works. This is just my way of giving back. I broke the rules, I went on my own, produced videos, started a website and now a magazine.

I never said there is one all-being formula. Ignore every guideline I wrote in here and come back to prove me wrong, show me some artsy butt shots that will blow my mind. Take 3 minutes of 3 shuvs and edit a 30 minute slow mo video laid over the dopest dub step mix ever crapped out of a computer. Break my rules! 2013! The year wakeskating turns into art!
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PostPosted: Oct 22, 2012 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tad, I don't think you're trying to tell people how to compose shots, and the f stop thing was brought up in another post. I'm just saying that a lot of what I'm reading is (lightly) suggestive of a more black-and-white right and wrong way to do things, and I think it's important to at least mention that it's good to go off of the typical tracks when taking about media. Of course I know you're being sarcastic, but you're still offering sound advice and I wanted to add my bit.
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tad
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PostPosted: Oct 22, 2012 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well since those are the only 2 subjects you brought up in your first post, do you mind specifying which "tips" you think are ok to go off track with?

I agree with what you said in your first post and I'm not trying to argue with you, I would just love to hear your opinion.
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PostPosted: Oct 23, 2012 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think a big amount of slow motion can be cool, for starters. I'm not saying I'd love to see every video at 50% of normal speed. Aquafrolics, for example, did an excellent job with it and it looked like almost every clip was at somewhere around 80%. I really dig that amount of slo-mo consistently because it didn't leave me wanting to rewind anything to see it again.

Butt shots I think are pretty okay (no homo) usually. A lot of tricks look better from that angle and I'd usually rather see a shot from behind than one from across the wake. I'm referring mostly to ski shots, as winching is a whole different story and everything is so dependent on the spot and the trick. Sometimes that restricts your options and sometimes (usually) it opens more.

I can also dig a long intro if it's done correctly. By that I mean if the intro is composed of visually interesting shots. I like to see more than just a bunch of tricks back to back. I can see how, to some people, everything else is a bunch of fluff; But I like videos to document a little more.

I'm with you as far as keeping it simple personally. There are definitely a lot of videos out there that seem to overcompensate poor filming with over-editing. I've also seen some videos that are pretty heavily edited that work out well. My point here is that editing is a lot like composing. The goal is to make all the pieces work together, and if you as an editor can handle an orchestra, go for it.

That's all that I'll cover right now but you get what I'm saying. There are exceptions to everything and the most important thing is to think comprehensively when shooting, and don't be afraid to do something different.

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tad
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PostPosted: Oct 23, 2012 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you're putting everything in slow mo like Aquafrolics, it's not "doing something different." It's copying Aquafrolics. It's better to have people rewatching your video as opposed to falling asleep or closing out of it the first time. But hey, that's just an opinion.

And you're talking about long intro's "if they are done correctly" after you just gave me crap for claiming a right and wrong way of doing things, haha. I never said what to put in your intro, but a 90 second intro for a video that has 5 sketched out tricks is a little over the top. (The video that sparked this thread.)

There are exceptions to everything, I clearly stated that in the butt shot tip. But coming from someone that has learned all of this from trial and error, I still think these guidelines are a good starting point for people that aren't to the level of "handling an orchestra."
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PostPosted: Oct 23, 2012 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He never said, copy aquafrolics. He merely cited aquafrolics as a good example of slow motion usage. Rland is another good example, or maybe a polarizing example.

Also, his comment on correctness was merely a comment with a request (interesting shots), not a formula or guide book for what makes something "correct."

I probably shouldn't even get involved. I love what you did with mtm and respect your work, but you're pretty defensive over a half sarcastic post. Let people trip and learn from their mistakes, instead of presenting the serious comments as absolutes.

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tad
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PostPosted: Oct 23, 2012 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Haha not getting defensive, just discussing on a discussion forum.

Out of the 30+ random tidbits written on the first page, I only managed to get discussion out of 3... I'm actually disappointed, haha. Hopefully the rest were helpful.

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scott a
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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2012 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With beginners, I've always found it most helpful to teach them the 'rules' and then let them explore beyond that as they start to figure things out. To tell someone that there are only guidelines and that you can do whatever you want, you're just going to have people trying to recreate what they've seen in that one video (with the same music)...except the video sucks because they're shooting into the sun in 'little green box' mode and the shot is out of focus and crooked.

So in a way I think the 'absolutes' and 'rules' are best early on. Then at some point creativity will take over...

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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2012 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

scott a, agreed.

Most of the tips on here are just little informative pieces of knowledge (or jokes) that people might wonder about along the way. This is not a guidebook to make videos or photos "correct." It's just a thread with some opinions of a poor dude with a camera that refuses to get a real job because he'd rather live out of a car documenting wakeskating. This industry is hard enough as it is, what's wrong with helping the kids out a little bit?

There are no rules to art, but if you're sending photos and videos into a mag for a year and don't know why they aren't getting ran, hit me up cause I'd love to try and help out. I'm still learning myself but I may be able to point you in the right direction. You don't know how bad I would love to see more wakeskate photographers and videographers out there documenting this fun activity we all enjoy so much.
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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2012 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I word things the way I do for a reason. I didn't say you're claiming a right and wrong way of doing things. I said that what I'm reading suggests it. I've talked with you enough to know you're not some spicebush (auto corrected from douchebag but I like spicebush) who thinks he can tell everyone how to do things and that's not what I'm trying to say. Reading objectively though, it seemed a little black and white. Furthermore, I'm not "giving you crap" about anything. Just discussing on a discussion forum.
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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2012 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.thrashermagazine.com/articles/magazine/photo-g-cautionary-tales-2012/

Laughing Laughing Laughing

Please refer to the "bad moon rising" section to get a better understanding of what I'm talking about when I say "butt shot." Filming chase behind the rider isn't a butt shot, it's just... backside? Haha.

http://www.thrashermagazine.com/articles/magazine/photo-g-cautionary-tales/

Another one, the opening paragraph sounds familiar. Those articles gave me a good laugh.
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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2012 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damn, where was that article when they were filming sfumato.

Woah, there was my stab at sarcasm.

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PostPosted: Oct 29, 2012 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slapdown, I've been taught when shooting on DSLRs to keep the shutter speed at double what your sequence is set at. Example, if your sequence is at 30 fps (29.97 technically) then keep your shutter speed at at least 1/60. I recently shot cars at high speeds on a racetrack at various shutter speeds. I'll check the footage in the edit to see if there is a major difference when shooting under 1/250.
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PostPosted: Oct 30, 2012 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote





This is what you guys are talking about right?

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